A "full' boat survey would cost £620 (£500+120vat) but first we have to pay to have the boat hauled out. Looking at a SPRINGER, and yes we are looking at a Springer, the broker would need an 'excess' as he would have to use extra gear. "because it has not got a flat bottom and you will need to hire our special cradle". Pencil in £350+70vat and we have exceeded £1000 all of of which we could lose if the boat fails? I am a small budget guy, but if your boat coast ten times mine the survey cost is likely to be much the same because all the same teat have to be done no matter how small or big the boat is.
The "special cradle" boost is a total load of horseshite but, being a novice, you don't know that do you so you pay up. But you pay up anyway because otherwise you don't get to have your potential purchase surveyed. That is how the marina system works. Just .. remember .. you .. heard .. it .. here. REAL 36ft Springers have a very shallow angle and can be treated as though they are flat-bottomed. Who would have known that coming in off the sea, having been told that all canal boats have flat bottoms?
The "special cradle" boost is a total load of horseshite but, being a novice, you don't know that do you so you pay up. But you pay up anyway because otherwise you don't get to have your potential purchase surveyed. That is how the marina system works. Just .. remember .. you .. heard .. it .. here. REAL 36ft Springers have a very shallow angle and can be treated as though they are flat-bottomed. Who would have known that coming in off the sea, having been told that all canal boats have flat bottoms?
You can only have a boat surveyed at a
brokerage after you've made an offer in
writing on a legally watertight contract
subsequently accepted by the seller.
Sounds daft, but that is how the system works. Also, you must lay down a 10% deposit and commit to purchase before a surveyor is allowed near the boat. Have you got that? You have to negotiate a price first and that price has to be accepted by the seller. You then hand over a tenth of the agreed price to the seller's agent BEFORE handing over £350 to the yard and £620 to the surveyor before getting a slot to do the actual survey
This is a good time to underline that a particular broker may have "a mutual arrangement' with a particular surveyor. I know of at least one marina where, if you want a surveyor who has no 'agreement' in place, they require the survey to be done out in the cut, but in clear view! Fat chance of getting at the only part which matters: the wetted hull.
Watch yourselves ... There are some right sharks in and around the soup.
There is some VERY interesting small print in a "legally watertight contract" ... like:-
" if a survey shows up defects which can be 'fixed' within a contracted budget, fixing is done by the SELLER or his "AGENT" but at the BUYER'S expense. No prizes for guessing who the "agent" is?
The broker has you over a barrel. He brings in a few apes, pays them a few peanuts, gets some monkey work done, pockets the margins, and the surveyor may even be in on it! Muggins pays wads ON TOP of the price, for a boat which enters your life ropey
This was NOT applicable to my purchase but appears to be what had happened to Pentargon when the previous owner purchased it ... Buyers come rarely with experience in sheet metal fabrication, plumbing, carpentry, engines, gearboxes, sign-writing, galvanic corrosion and the price of a short length of string.
SMALL PRINT.
If a boat should fail a marine survey under the terms of a legally binding marine contract (because the faults cannot be put right for x% of the agreed price) the 'buyer' can walk away. But all you get back is your deposit. You should be prepared to 'lose' up to £1000 (for survey, slipping and slippage) and have nothing to show for it at the end of the day apart from a gaping hole in your wallet about the same size as a nice holiday for two in Madeira
Interesting side issue to a failed survey.
Sometimes, in doing the test, the surveyor might knock a hole through the hull under the water-line with his little hammer. Under these circumstances, the boat is instantly failed by the surveyor and the broker is notified. The boat cannot be put back in the water until "repaired".
As of that moment, it is both unsailable and unsaleable because the hole so hammered might cause it to sink in the water.
This clause matters with the Titanic, which went down in 11,000' of water but it also applies to canal boats which might not have 2" of free water under them at times.
The broker is now under notice, by the actual survey and marine law, that the boat is unsafe and he has to henceforth declare this fact. Before that he could (and would) stay mum and be legally entitled to.
This little is gem is entered for readers who might be SELLING a boat which gets surveyed. This law applies only under brokerage where participants are deemed to be qualified professionals capable of delivering expert opinions and NOT to unqualified owners. An 'owner' by defitition is unqualified unless he has certificates to show he is qualified.
brokerage after you've made an offer in
writing on a legally watertight contract
subsequently accepted by the seller.
Sounds daft, but that is how the system works. Also, you must lay down a 10% deposit and commit to purchase before a surveyor is allowed near the boat. Have you got that? You have to negotiate a price first and that price has to be accepted by the seller. You then hand over a tenth of the agreed price to the seller's agent BEFORE handing over £350 to the yard and £620 to the surveyor before getting a slot to do the actual survey
This is a good time to underline that a particular broker may have "a mutual arrangement' with a particular surveyor. I know of at least one marina where, if you want a surveyor who has no 'agreement' in place, they require the survey to be done out in the cut, but in clear view! Fat chance of getting at the only part which matters: the wetted hull.
Watch yourselves ... There are some right sharks in and around the soup.
There is some VERY interesting small print in a "legally watertight contract" ... like:-
" if a survey shows up defects which can be 'fixed' within a contracted budget, fixing is done by the SELLER or his "AGENT" but at the BUYER'S expense. No prizes for guessing who the "agent" is?
The broker has you over a barrel. He brings in a few apes, pays them a few peanuts, gets some monkey work done, pockets the margins, and the surveyor may even be in on it! Muggins pays wads ON TOP of the price, for a boat which enters your life ropey
This was NOT applicable to my purchase but appears to be what had happened to Pentargon when the previous owner purchased it ... Buyers come rarely with experience in sheet metal fabrication, plumbing, carpentry, engines, gearboxes, sign-writing, galvanic corrosion and the price of a short length of string.
SMALL PRINT.
If a boat should fail a marine survey under the terms of a legally binding marine contract (because the faults cannot be put right for x% of the agreed price) the 'buyer' can walk away. But all you get back is your deposit. You should be prepared to 'lose' up to £1000 (for survey, slipping and slippage) and have nothing to show for it at the end of the day apart from a gaping hole in your wallet about the same size as a nice holiday for two in Madeira
Interesting side issue to a failed survey.
Sometimes, in doing the test, the surveyor might knock a hole through the hull under the water-line with his little hammer. Under these circumstances, the boat is instantly failed by the surveyor and the broker is notified. The boat cannot be put back in the water until "repaired".
As of that moment, it is both unsailable and unsaleable because the hole so hammered might cause it to sink in the water.
This clause matters with the Titanic, which went down in 11,000' of water but it also applies to canal boats which might not have 2" of free water under them at times.
The broker is now under notice, by the actual survey and marine law, that the boat is unsafe and he has to henceforth declare this fact. Before that he could (and would) stay mum and be legally entitled to.
This little is gem is entered for readers who might be SELLING a boat which gets surveyed. This law applies only under brokerage where participants are deemed to be qualified professionals capable of delivering expert opinions and NOT to unqualified owners. An 'owner' by defitition is unqualified unless he has certificates to show he is qualified.
